Translate

Showing posts with label Churches. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Churches. Show all posts

Wednesday, June 11, 2025

Turned off by the church, some notes

The following notes were made by me when I listened to someone online talking about folks in our days being “turned off by the church.” I failed to write down the source, it has been awhile since I made the notes, and now I do not know who he was. Nevertheless, I am going to post the notes here, thinking they might benefit someone. (If anyone recognizes the source, please let me know.)

Why are some people turned off by the church?

  • By the people.
  • By the preacher.
  • By the hypocrisy.
  • By begging (being robbed in church)
  • By the message being polluted.
  • By the sexual harassment.
  • By promoting everything but Jesus Christ!

3 primary problems: We have abandoned our master; we have abandoned our mission of making disciples; we have abandoned our message.

Master. (John 13:13) They hung him high, stretched him wide, and dropped him low. Low in the grave he lay, but up from the grave he arose.

Mission. And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth. Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen. (Matthew 28:18-20)

Message. (2 Timothy 4:2) If we do not know what the Bible is, then we do not know what the Bible says. If we do not know what the Bible says, then we cannot speak with authority from it.

“You can’t love Christ and hate his church.” There is a difference between frustration and hatred.

“Unfortunately, a lot of people meet other Christians before they meet Christ.” Tony Kennedy.

Tuesday, June 14, 2022

Pastors, Parents, and Worldviews

The American Worldview Inventory 2022 Study of Parents and Pastors provides “shocking results concerning the worldview of Christian pastors”: “...a new nationwide survey among a representative sample of America’s Christian pastors shows that a large majority of those pastors do not possess a biblical worldview.” “The latest AWVI 2022 release from the Cultural Research Center at Arizona Christian University indicates that barely one-half of the pastors of evangelical churches (51%) have a biblical worldview.” There are related posts at the following link:


  • AWVI 2022: The Worldview Dilemma of American Parents (Release #01: 03-08-2022)
  • AWVI 2022: The Strengths and Weaknesses of What Pre-Teen Parents Believe and Do (Release #02: 03-29-2022)
  • AWVI 2022: A Detailed Look at How the Worldview of Parents of Preteens Misses the Mark (Release #03: 04-12-2022)
  • AWVI 2022: Improving Parents’ Ability to Raise Spiritual Champions (Release #04: 04-26-2022)
  • AWVI 2022: Shocking Results Concerning the Worldview of Christian Pastors (Release #05: 05-12-2022)
  • AWVI 2022: Only Half of Evangelical Pastors Possess a Biblical Worldview; Incidence Even Lower for Most Denominations (Release #06: 05-24-2022)
It should be no surprise, considering the evidence in this study, that Christianity in the United States is in dire straits. In relation to this study, Janet Parshall interviewed George Barna on In the Market radio. In the discussion, he pointed out our problematic standards of grading a successful church. Our modern measures of success are primarily (based on my writing them after he said them, so maybe not exactly in his words):
  • How many attendees (influence)
  • How many programs (relevance)
  • How many people on staff (respectability)
  • How much money collected (affluence)
  • What kind of building owned (accommodations, number of square feet)
If we judge the success of churches by the number of people, programs, & personnel, and the amount of property & prosperity, we cannot help but go astray. May the Lord help us return to the old paths (Jeremiah 6:16).

Monday, March 28, 2022

When...I went into the sanctuary of God...

The house of God is, always has been, and always will be the best place to do theology.

  • Psalm 27:4 One thing have I desired of the Lord, that will I seek after; that I may dwell in the house of the Lord all the days of my life, to behold the beauty of the Lord, and to enquire in his temple.
  • Psalm 55:14 We took sweet counsel together, and walked unto the house of God in company.
  • Psalm 73:16-17 When I thought to know this, it was too painful for me; until I went into the sanctuary of God; then understood I their end.
  • Psalm 92:13 Those that be planted in the house of the Lord shall flourish in the courts of our God.
  • Psalm 122:1 I was glad when they said unto me, Let us go into the house of the Lord.
  • 1 Timothy 3:15 but if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.
  • 1 Peter 2:5 ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.

Thursday, June 10, 2021

One Race

The Bible’s teaching on “race” is simple. Someone has said three fundamental truths about it are that we are (1) one in creation; (2) one in the church; and (3) one in eternity. Notice the following biblical texts.

One in creation
  • Genesis 1:26-27. And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth. So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
  • Genesis 3:20 And Adam called his wife’s name Eve; because she was the mother of all living.
  • Acts 17:26-28. and hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation; that they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us: for in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring.
  • Malachi 2:10 Have we not all one father? hath not one God created us?
One in the church
  • John 10:16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.
  • Galatians 3:28. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
  • Ephesians 2:19-22 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God; and are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone; in whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord: in whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.
  • Colossians 3:11. where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.
One in eternity
  • Galatians 3:8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.
  • Revelation 7:9. After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;
  • Revelation 21:22-26 And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it. And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof. And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it. And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there. And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it.

Saturday, August 01, 2020

Church, Covid, and State

The church in word and by nature is an assembly. While a church may voluntary choose to temporarily comply with certain advice due to health concerns, governmental restrictions against assembly attacks the very nature of the church.

Thursday, December 14, 2017

Knollys on Church

The quote below is written by 17th century London Baptist Hanserd Knollys on the subject of the church. It is interesting; though I am not sure I entirely comprehend his meaning.

[And send it unto the Seven Churches, which are in Asia, &c.] Those Seven Churches were planted by the Apostles in the Seven principal Cities in the Lesser Asia, here named, and hence each particular Church denominated, as appears in the Second and Third Chapters of this Book, in the exposition whereof, more will be spoken of this matter: All that I shall say in general touching these, (and other Churches of God mentioned in the holy Scripture) in this place is,
First, That each Church contained and comprehended, the whole number of them that believed in Jesus Christ, confessed the Faith of the Gospel, and walked in the Order and Ordinances of the Lord in one City and Suburbs thereof; and had the Denomination of that City, and was called the Church of God in that City. Search these Scriptures, Act. 8. 1. and 11. 22. also, I Cor. 1. 2. and 14. 34. likewise, Phil. 1. 1, 5. and I Thess. 1. 1.  Rev. 2. 1, 8, 12, 18. and Chap. 3. 1, 7, 14.
Secondly, Although the Church in any City, at the beginning and first Planting of it, was but one Congregation, and assembled themselves together in one place, Act. 2. 1. and 4. 31, and I Cor. 14. 23. yet when the number of the Disciples was multiplied, Act. 4. 32. and 6. 1, 2. and Multitudes both Men and Women were added to the Lord, and by the Lord to the Church, Act. 2. 41, 47. and 4. 4. and 5. 14. then the Church was necessitated, for the Edification of the Multitude, and great number of the Members thereof, to assemble themselves together in particular Congregations, and became distinct Companies, of whom we read Act. 4.19, 23. Peter and John had their own Company or Congregation, and so had Paul and Barnabas; and each Company or Congregation had their Elders and Deacons, Phil. 1. 1. and the denomination of the Church, I Cor. 16. 1. and are called Churches, I Cor. 16. 16. The Apostles Writing to the Saints in the Church of Corinth, said, Let your Women keep silence in the Churches, I Cor. 14. 34. and 2 Cor. 8. 24. Shew ye to them, and before the Churches, the proof of your Love.
Thirdly, Church is an Homogenial word,[i] As Water in the Sea, in a River, in a Well, and in a Spoon, is called Water; so the Assembly or Congregation of Sanctified Believers in the general Assembly, is called the Church, Heb. 12. 23. and the particular Assemblies or Congregations in an City is called the Church, I Cor. 1. 1, 2. so in any Village or Town, Rom. 16. 1. yea, in any House, Col. 4. 15.



[i] By “homogenial word” I believe Knollys simply means that the same word (church) is used whether talking about all believers (the general assembly), all believers meeting in a city, all believers meeting in a house, etc.

Sunday, October 08, 2017

The Model Church

The Model Church by John Henry Yates

1. Well, wife, I’ve found the model church,
And worshipped there today;
It made me think of good old times,
Before my hair was gray;
The meeting house was finer built
Than they were years ago,
But then I found when I went in,
It was not built for show.

2. The sexton did not set me down
Away back by the door;
He knew that I was old and deaf,
And saw that I was poor;
He must have been a Christian man,
He led me boldly through
The crowded aisle of that grand church,
To find a pleasant pew.

3. I wish you’d heard the singing, wife,
It had the old-time ring;
The preacher said with trumpet voice,
Let all the people sing:
Old Coronation was the tune;
The music upward rolled
Until I tho’t the angel choir
Struck all their harps of gold.

4. My deafness seemed to melt away,
My spirit caught the fire;
I joined my feeble, trembling voice
With that melodious choir;
And sang as in my youthful days,
Let angels prostrate fall.
Bring forth the royal diadem
And crown Him Lord of all.

5. I tell you, wife, it did me good
To sing that hymn once more;
I felt like some wrecked mariner
Who gets a glimpse of shore;
I almost want to lay aside
This weather beaten form,
And anchor in the blessèd port,
Forever from the storm.

6. ’Twas not a flowery sermon, wife,
But simple gospel truth;
It fitted humble men like me;
It suited hopeful youth;
To win immortal souls to Christ,
The earnest preacher tried;
He talked not of himself, or creed,
But Jesus crucified.

7. Dear wife, the toil will soon be o’er,
The vict’ry soon be won;
The shining land is just ahead,
Our race is nearly run;
We’re nearing Canaan’s happy shore,
Our home so bright and fair;
Thank God, we’ll never sin again,
There’ll be no sorrow there.

Friday, September 15, 2017

The Ideal Church

I finally found the Ideal Church and joined it...

It’s not the Ideal Church any more.

Friday, August 23, 2013

Junk Food Religion

The appeal of junk food restaurants is similar to the appeal of “junk food” religion. The quality of fast food and prepared food is generally inferior to that we cook at home. Yet we flock to these restaurants. The reasons people go in droves to public eating establishments are the same as the reasons some people go to a particular church.

As some eat at a certain fast food chain because of the playground equipment, so some go to a church for the same reason.

As some eat wherever the children want to eat, so some attend wherever the children want to go to church.

As some agree to eat where everyone else wants to eat, so some worship wherever their friends are going.

As some go to a restaurant because they can get in and out quickly, so some go to a church where they can get in, get through, and get home.

As some choose a place to eat that will have something to suit everyone in the family, so some choose a church that will try to please everyone.

As some eat at a restaurant they perceive to be cheap, so some attend a church where little or nothing is expected of them.

Our choice of a place to eat often has little or nothing to do with the quality and purity of the food; little to well support the main reason we are going there - to eat. Most people do not choose a restaurant because they serve healthy, wholesome, nourishing food.

Why do you go to a particular church? We should attend a church that serves up the whole Word of God, which is milk and meat to our bones. Oh, may we taste and see that the Lord is good!

Oh, taste and see the Lord is good, 
I heard the Psalmist say.
I tasted; oh, what wondrous food!
He's blessed me from that day.

Adapted from The Baptist Waymark

Friday, May 18, 2012

Baptist Denominationalism

Bart Barber, whom I consider an internet friend[1] and a biblical Christian, has recently written about “monochurches”. He also has a well-thought and well-argued chapter[2] on denominationalism in Upon This Rock: a Baptist Understanding of the Church. Nevertheless, I don’t agree with his conclusions. Reading and interacting at his blog provides the background for my discussing this here.

Hoping to represent him fairly, I’d say Bart concludes that denominations are a tertium quid, a “third thing” which stands somewhere between local church ministry and parachurch ministry (p. 134).[3] He further concludes that denominations are both biblical and useful.

Brother Barber addresses the elephant in the room that is too often assumed or ignored. What makes a denomination? How do we define it? He ties denominational barriers to the boundaries of ministerial service and membership (pp. 136-137). I will address denominations in this way. Denominations for the practical purpose of this blog post are groups such as the Southern Baptist Convention, American Baptist Churches in the USA, Baptist Missionary Association of America.[4]

I have no problem with “associations” and “conventions” as advisory councils. While I wish not to “fight” them, I believe conventions and associations as continuing organizational entities are neither biblical nor useful. Unlike councils or presbyteries which meet to conduct business/give advice[5] and cease to exist, denominational organizations linger on “to elicit, combine, and direct the energies of the denomination...”

I find three problems with denominationalism as commonly practiced by modern Baptists.

1. Denominationalism that rejects normative biblical practice is disobedient (violates orthopraxy). Here modern Baptists are distinctly deficient, and are weighed and found wanting. Baptists who once based their practice on New Testament practice now find the vast majority of New Testament practice to be “descriptive” rather than “prescriptive.” This is a nice little deflection from saying they believe their own convolutions are better than those of the apostles and prophets. “We live in a different world; that won’t work anymore.” Such a rethinking will eventually rethink Baptists out of existence, and even already has for a number of them. Are we free to develop our own organizations any more than our own orthodoxy? That is the question. Is it of any consequence that there are no national or denomination-wide organizations in the New Testament? The majority of Baptists seem to have already answered that is of no consequence – we are free to develop our own methods to suit our own needs. If so, biblical orthopraxy is of no consequence. But if apostolic practice is normative, not only our doctrine but also our practice should be guided by the New Testament. Time and again we read statements such as “so ordain I in all churches,” “as in all churches of the saints,” “be ye followers of me,” and “ye ought to follow us.” I contend that these commands direct us in seeking the old paths of the apostles and New Testament churches rather than carving out our own.

2. Denominationalism that usurps church authority is unscriptural (violates orthodoxy). The autonomy and authority of the local church is a distinct Baptist precept. Let me hasten to say that there is one sense in which Baptist denominationalism generally and consistently does not violate church authority. Baptist churches enter voluntarily into their associations and conventions, and they participate or do not participate in the part or parts of the denomination each particular local church chooses. The area in which denominations usurp church authority is that of taking on themselves the work given the churches. The majority of Baptists recognize the Great Commission (Matthew 28:18-20) as a church commission, yet many of these same Baptists operate within organizations which do the work themselves (e.g. operate seminaries) or decide who can do it (e.g. elect and send missionaries). Also at question here is whether churches may delegate the authority given them by their Lord to another entity for that entity to carry out. The apostles never organized another entity to carry out the work given to the churches. If so, why should we?

3. Denominationalism that separates sister churches is sinful (violates orthokardy). Denominationalism separates sister churches by artificial means. The tendency is for members of a particular Baptist denomination (convention, national or general association) – unless they are highly ecumenical – to view all churches which are affiliated with their denomination (SBC, for example) as sister churches and view those outside their denomination not as sister churches. This inserts a non-biblical third party between churches as a deciding factor in whether they are of like faith and order. Instead, the biblical faith and practice of particular local churches ought to be the deciding factor as to whether they are of like faith and order. If not, we deny the autonomy and independence of local churches that we profess. Organizations should not artificially divide God’s churches. Faith and practice not according to the Scriptures should be the only matter separating churches.

This “tirade” against denominationalism is not an indictment against cooperation and interdependency of biblical churches. A scan of the New Testament shows that without any denominational organizations, autonomous churches operated in the spirit of family, love and cooperation. Without instant communication, Christians across the Roman Empire knew about, prayed and cared for one another, and labored in unison of service and purpose. Much of the so-called independent Baptist movement in the Western world has turned New Testament Christianity on its head by exalting isolationism, ignorance and self-confidence above the obvious New Testament example of autonomous interdependence. On the other hand, churches with tight denominational connections also fall short of the true New Testament practice of orthodoxy (right doctrine), orthopraxy (right practice), and orthokardy (right heart). In these cases the true denominational influence is not a bonded brotherhood but simply the common use of the same machinery which drives “fraternal” relations. With Brother Barber, I approve the “cooperative connection among New Testament congregations.” We just haven’t yet found agreement on exactly how all that plays out in denominational life. To me it might look something like this:

Ideally churches of New Testament caliber which move under the direction of the Spirit & the Word and need no organizations to elicit, combine and direct their energies. But we don’t live in an ideal world, and I don’t expect the developments of several centuries to suddenly dissolve into thin air. Yet Baptist churches that take their autonomy, independency and interdependency seriously and that exalt the Saviour first of all might learn to hold His churches in the highest esteem; to regard them not on the basis of affiliation with an organization, but rather affiliation with Christ, His Word, His faith, His practice, and His love.

Let “Back to the Bible” be our cry, as it was for our forefathers. May all false systems fall before the sword of the Spirit, the word of God!

Footnotes
[1] Since we’ve not met face to face.
[2] Chapter 6, A Denomination of Churches: Biblical and Useful
[3] A cooperative ministry of multiple congregations similar to an ordination presbytery
[4] In the area of taxonomy, I consider these to be “sub-denominations” of Baptists.
[5] The business of the council is to give advice.

Saturday, March 24, 2012

Crooked 2 by 4's

Yesterday I commented on The Problem of Protestant Ecclesiology -- generally and specifically the post of that name by Daniel Wallace. In this piece and another, Wallace writes, “The ideal church can’t exist.” If I understand him correctly, I agree. While there is an ideal church concept in the Bible, a real church with real people will never be ideal. Actual congregations are hotbeds of redeemed sinners on whom God is still working.

Thinking on this today, I was struck with the similarity of looking for an ideal church in a world of churches and looking for a straight board in a bundle of 2X4's. I guess I'm a stickler for "straight" whether it's churches or lumber. Every once in awhile I conceive of a project -- which always requires straight 2X4's. So I head out to the lumber yard to find the same. After having put an eagle eye down the edges of half the bundle,* my standards begin to change. Having looked at a hundred or so bowed, warped, and twisted boards, I sadly realize -- another bundle of 2X4's without a perfectly straight one amongst them. The ideal 2X4 doesn't exist! So the new goal becomes not a perfectly straight 2X4, but one that is only slightly bowed from one end to the other -- nothing twisted or warped badly, and certainly nothing that would excel as a rocking chair bottom. If I don't find the ideal, I'll settle for what is the best among the less than perfect. 

"Settling" might not be a good term regarding finding a church home. But as Wallace says, the ideal church doesn't exist. If our standards are too straight we'll not find a congregational home. And we should find one. We need it. The assembly of God's people that you visit may have a few splinters, knots, and cracks. It might be a little too hot or too cold at times. It may not be perfectly plumb and square. Avoid all those that are twisted and warped, but exhibit wisdom, mercy and grace in your search, hoping to find the best among the less than perfect. (And as they say, if you DO find the perfect church -- don't join it, you'll mess it up.)

*If you pick through lumber, please re-stack it.